Articles
I would like to thank Coni for allowing me to reprint her article here. I value and respect her opinion.
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Re: Meat goats/fullblood Boers
Posted by: "Coni Ross" crranch@moment.net
Sat Oct 13, 2007 5:24 am (PST)
First: In my opinion, the Boer goat is the ultimate meat goat.
Last weekend, I was at a goat conference in Lexington, NE. There was a
question posed: How much value is there in the rack on a goat?
The Spanish goat, and the average goat that goes through the auction has so
little rack that the meat goes into the ground or trimming cut.
If you look at the modern market show wether, you will see that most of
those goats have a rack that is cuttable. The market wether producer has
selected breeding animals with a muscle over that ribcage that will stand up
off of the ribs in a definite rack. Goats with a carcass like that bring top
prices at the auction, and win shows in the show ring. They have a rack like
a lamb.
A fullblood Boer with a rack like that won Grand Champion buck at ABGA
Nationals. He was very long, he was very thick, and he was very muscular. He
was deep bodied, not fat, and very masculine, with a big bold head. So,
now I ask you, what is wrong with a goat that is a beautiful fullblood Boer
with a carcass like that?
We need to keep in mind that we sell bucks to commercial producers, and if
they can sell their kids from that buck for top prices, they will be back
for more bucks in the future.
I have put hands on thousands of goats, and some of those " old fashioned'
full blood Boers had no rack. The American rancher has developed a carcass
animal out of their genetics that would win in a carcass contest every time.
Not to knock old genetics, I have lots of those old genetics, with CODI
blood lines, and the goats I have do have a muscle over the top of that
ribcage (rack). It is not just old fashioned vs. modern.
Many of those original goats that came out of quarantine from New Zealand
had genetic problems from line breeding too long. They did not start with
enough different bloodlines to avoid it. We saw animals with a bad mouths,
ewe necks, poor legs, and pasterns, sloppy top lines, and a pinched heart
girth.
The pinched heart girth is visible just behind the elbow. The skeleton is
pinched in there, and the organs are pushed back into the abdominal cavity;
thus, many of the early Boer Goats has a big belly. This was not from body
capacity, it was from that pinch in the heart girth.
The long smooth goat is not a tube goat if there is depth from front to
back. Look at a doe that is correct: she should have a feminine wedge, not
look tubular. A buck should have a masculine appearance, with depth of body,
and length of body, not a shallow body. I do like some wrinkles, but do not
like excessive wrinkling. In Texas, those wrinkles if excessive can harbor
insect pests, and cause problems. I have also seen fungus be chronic in some
of the old bucks in those folds.
I think that when some people think a goat is a tube goat, they do not
recognize that the goat merely does not have a belly.
Someone on this list said last week that ALL pasture goats had bellies. That
is not true. Goats on poor forage may have a belly, but goats can be fat and
not have a belly. A belly is often from consumption of poor quality hay or
forage, filling up the digestive tract with non digestible vegetation. I do
not own a goat with that huge belly.
MY commercial does are all % Boer X Cashmere, and they are very vigorous,
have natural worm immunity, and they do not have bellies. They are big,
robust, smooth, and not tube goats either.
The appearance of a TUBE may be because the goat in question has a round
ribcage with muscle over the top of that ribcage (a rack) one of the most
valuable cuts of meat. (if it is there). I do not breed a buck that does not
have that muscle over the top of the ribs.
I do think that the Boer goat can produce the best carcass animal out there,
and is very valuable to the meat market. Again, if we want to sell them to
the commercial breeder, we need to concentrate on the sound, healthy buck
with lots of muscle.
By the way, a lot of my fullblood kids become market wethers. Not every buck
born is or should be used as a stud goat.
I think we just have some confusion over semantics.
Coni Ross
Last weekend, I was at a goat conference in Lexington, NE. There was a
question posed: How much value is there in the rack on a goat?
The Spanish goat, and the average goat that goes through the auction has so
little rack that the meat goes into the ground or trimming cut.
If you look at the modern market show wether, you will see that most of
those goats have a rack that is cuttable. The market wether producer has
selected breeding animals with a muscle over that ribcage that will stand up
off of the ribs in a definite rack. Goats with a carcass like that bring top
prices at the auction, and win shows in the show ring. They have a rack like
a lamb.
A fullblood Boer with a rack like that won Grand Champion buck at ABGA
Nationals. He was very long, he was very thick, and he was very muscular. He
was deep bodied, not fat, and very masculine, with a big bold head. So,
now I ask you, what is wrong with a goat that is a beautiful fullblood Boer
with a carcass like that?
We need to keep in mind that we sell bucks to commercial producers, and if
they can sell their kids from that buck for top prices, they will be back
for more bucks in the future.
I have put hands on thousands of goats, and some of those " old fashioned'
full blood Boers had no rack. The American rancher has developed a carcass
animal out of their genetics that would win in a carcass contest every time.
Not to knock old genetics, I have lots of those old genetics, with CODI
blood lines, and the goats I have do have a muscle over the top of that
ribcage (rack). It is not just old fashioned vs. modern.
Many of those original goats that came out of quarantine from New Zealand
had genetic problems from line breeding too long. They did not start with
enough different bloodlines to avoid it. We saw animals with a bad mouths,
ewe necks, poor legs, and pasterns, sloppy top lines, and a pinched heart
girth.
The pinched heart girth is visible just behind the elbow. The skeleton is
pinched in there, and the organs are pushed back into the abdominal cavity;
thus, many of the early Boer Goats has a big belly. This was not from body
capacity, it was from that pinch in the heart girth.
The long smooth goat is not a tube goat if there is depth from front to
back. Look at a doe that is correct: she should have a feminine wedge, not
look tubular. A buck should have a masculine appearance, with depth of body,
and length of body, not a shallow body. I do like some wrinkles, but do not
like excessive wrinkling. In Texas, those wrinkles if excessive can harbor
insect pests, and cause problems. I have also seen fungus be chronic in some
of the old bucks in those folds.
I think that when some people think a goat is a tube goat, they do not
recognize that the goat merely does not have a belly.
Someone on this list said last week that ALL pasture goats had bellies. That
is not true. Goats on poor forage may have a belly, but goats can be fat and
not have a belly. A belly is often from consumption of poor quality hay or
forage, filling up the digestive tract with non digestible vegetation. I do
not own a goat with that huge belly.
MY commercial does are all % Boer X Cashmere, and they are very vigorous,
have natural worm immunity, and they do not have bellies. They are big,
robust, smooth, and not tube goats either.
The appearance of a TUBE may be because the goat in question has a round
ribcage with muscle over the top of that ribcage (a rack) one of the most
valuable cuts of meat. (if it is there). I do not breed a buck that does not
have that muscle over the top of the ribs.
I do think that the Boer goat can produce the best carcass animal out there,
and is very valuable to the meat market. Again, if we want to sell them to
the commercial breeder, we need to concentrate on the sound, healthy buck
with lots of muscle.
By the way, a lot of my fullblood kids become market wethers. Not every buck
born is or should be used as a stud goat.
I think we just have some confusion over semantics.
Coni Ross
I would like to thank Connie for letting me use this article on my website.
She dispenses good advice with her unique sense of humor. 
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Every year I get one or two calls from first time young buck owners
claiming that the young buck I had sold them was either "gay" or not
interested, or must be physically impaired. These are young bucks who
have never bred before and the owners have high expectations and
sometimes unreal expectations what these young fellows are capable of
doing.
So, I'll try to tell you some things I've noticed about young bucks
from fifteen years of raising and selling them. I don't know it all
and others can offer more insights, but this might help out the first
time owner of a young buck a little bit.
Some young bucks go to their new home and take off like firecrackers,
no problems, only thing holding them back is they might be too short
at four - six months of age to reach mature does.
But, for the many other young bucks who have "problems" it's usually
caused by unreal expectations of their inexperienced owners. A young
buck, even if he is up to a year old, that is suddenly taken from the
only home he's known and tossed into a herd of large mature does,
whom many are in heat, well, folks, it scares that poor young guy to
death. These mature does are expecting him to immediately breed
every single one of them right that instance and repeatedly. And, if
he doesn't, they ride him! Why, he's flabbergasted. Here he's not
at home and all these big strangers are after him! Heavens!
The pressure! He's never done this before and the expectations are
high to immediately get to work right now, both from the does and
from the owner. Who, by the way is calling him names, sounding
disgusted, and calling his beloved previous owner, Connie, terrible
names too.
And, too often, the first time young buck owner has waited until the
last minute to get a buck and is under a time pressure that these
girls have to be bred today if they are going to have kids to sell in
such and such a month. The breeding has to be done today and
finished by the end of the week!
Well, you might as well sit back and chill out. That young buck has
to get comfortable, use to his surroundings a bit, understand that
the goats crowding him aren't coming in for the kill, but for
something else entirely. If you have a time table to keep and
planned on getting a young inexperienced buck, plan well in advance
to get him there and get him comfortable and get his confidence built
up. He's never done this before. Maybe "sacrifice" a doe or two
early to him to experiment on. She'll kid sooner then anyone else,
but at least he'll be ready to service the other girls with more
experience and less wasted motion.
Recently I had a fellow call complaining about a young buck he had
just purchased. It seemed the fellow had taken this young buck
directly from his beloved home and had thrown him out into a herd of
70 does, all wanting him. The young buck froze up, terrified. Well,
culture shock would be a good word and also unreal expectations.
Even an older experienced buck couldn't have gotton 70 does bred in
two days.
Another unreal expectation is that a buck can breed indefinitely,
without stopping for rest or to build that sperm back up again. A
first time owners frequently complaint is he's just ignoring them.
Think, sometimes these bucks breed at night, and not under your
inquiring eyes. Sometimes they need a breather before they start
again. Catch their breaths, get a drink, something to eat, a nap,
something to restore them and then they will be more then willing to
get back to work.
Also a buck needs to be reasonably healthy to breed. He has to have
been wormed, fed well, looked after to do his job. He will run
himself into the ground breeding, once he catches on. You have to
take care of him. If he acts sluggish, take his temp. A buck with a
temp will not feel like breeding and will be sterile for a least a
month after he has gotton over his illness. After that, if properly
cared for, he's good as new and ready to work.
So, buy your inexperienced buck plenty of time in advance of when you
need him to breed. Put him on the other side of the fence of the
beauties you want him to breed. Let him look at them, lust over
them, and then when it's time to put him in, he'll be willing to
learn.
My own beloved older buck, Nico, as a youngster, took three heat
cycles before he caught on how to breed. He would be terribly
embarrassed if he knew I told you this, but he sure has made up for
it since. He was one of the worse young bucks I've ever seen to
finally catch on and what a pro he is today.
So, I hope these insights will help the new first time young buck
owner. And, cut that young buck a little slack.
Connie Reynolds - Autumn Farm
Ravenswood, WV
http://www.autumnfarmboers.com
claiming that the young buck I had sold them was either "gay" or not
interested, or must be physically impaired. These are young bucks who
have never bred before and the owners have high expectations and
sometimes unreal expectations what these young fellows are capable of
doing.
So, I'll try to tell you some things I've noticed about young bucks
from fifteen years of raising and selling them. I don't know it all
and others can offer more insights, but this might help out the first
time owner of a young buck a little bit.
Some young bucks go to their new home and take off like firecrackers,
no problems, only thing holding them back is they might be too short
at four - six months of age to reach mature does.
But, for the many other young bucks who have "problems" it's usually
caused by unreal expectations of their inexperienced owners. A young
buck, even if he is up to a year old, that is suddenly taken from the
only home he's known and tossed into a herd of large mature does,
whom many are in heat, well, folks, it scares that poor young guy to
death. These mature does are expecting him to immediately breed
every single one of them right that instance and repeatedly. And, if
he doesn't, they ride him! Why, he's flabbergasted. Here he's not
at home and all these big strangers are after him! Heavens!
The pressure! He's never done this before and the expectations are
high to immediately get to work right now, both from the does and
from the owner. Who, by the way is calling him names, sounding
disgusted, and calling his beloved previous owner, Connie, terrible
names too.
And, too often, the first time young buck owner has waited until the
last minute to get a buck and is under a time pressure that these
girls have to be bred today if they are going to have kids to sell in
such and such a month. The breeding has to be done today and
finished by the end of the week!
Well, you might as well sit back and chill out. That young buck has
to get comfortable, use to his surroundings a bit, understand that
the goats crowding him aren't coming in for the kill, but for
something else entirely. If you have a time table to keep and
planned on getting a young inexperienced buck, plan well in advance
to get him there and get him comfortable and get his confidence built
up. He's never done this before. Maybe "sacrifice" a doe or two
early to him to experiment on. She'll kid sooner then anyone else,
but at least he'll be ready to service the other girls with more
experience and less wasted motion.
Recently I had a fellow call complaining about a young buck he had
just purchased. It seemed the fellow had taken this young buck
directly from his beloved home and had thrown him out into a herd of
70 does, all wanting him. The young buck froze up, terrified. Well,
culture shock would be a good word and also unreal expectations.
Even an older experienced buck couldn't have gotton 70 does bred in
two days.
Another unreal expectation is that a buck can breed indefinitely,
without stopping for rest or to build that sperm back up again. A
first time owners frequently complaint is he's just ignoring them.
Think, sometimes these bucks breed at night, and not under your
inquiring eyes. Sometimes they need a breather before they start
again. Catch their breaths, get a drink, something to eat, a nap,
something to restore them and then they will be more then willing to
get back to work.
Also a buck needs to be reasonably healthy to breed. He has to have
been wormed, fed well, looked after to do his job. He will run
himself into the ground breeding, once he catches on. You have to
take care of him. If he acts sluggish, take his temp. A buck with a
temp will not feel like breeding and will be sterile for a least a
month after he has gotton over his illness. After that, if properly
cared for, he's good as new and ready to work.
So, buy your inexperienced buck plenty of time in advance of when you
need him to breed. Put him on the other side of the fence of the
beauties you want him to breed. Let him look at them, lust over
them, and then when it's time to put him in, he'll be willing to
learn.
My own beloved older buck, Nico, as a youngster, took three heat
cycles before he caught on how to breed. He would be terribly
embarrassed if he knew I told you this, but he sure has made up for
it since. He was one of the worse young bucks I've ever seen to
finally catch on and what a pro he is today.
So, I hope these insights will help the new first time young buck
owner. And, cut that young buck a little slack.
Connie Reynolds - Autumn Farm
Ravenswood, WV
http://www.autumnfarmboers.com